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Gothkid

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As many of you are aware, I've moved away from GW games and onto more independant games. So if you play a game thats not on the forum feel free to describe it here for those of us that are interested - a new wargame thats a little different is always good to explore.

So to anyone who does play different games, please tell us about them! Its always good to hear about different things from different peoples point of view. Alternatively review a game thats already been reviewed - as many different views as we can get!

Please note - this is not a GW bashing thread. This is to discuss/review games that are not part of GW.

Gothkid

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Flames of War - Published by Battlefront Miniatures.
Website -

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Overview
This is a very popular WWII wargame with a large UK following. It is much smaller in scale than 40K or WFB but larger than Epic - in a more direct term it is 15mm in scale!

It is a much more tactical game than either of the two main GW games and has a much lower body count! It aims to recreate WWII battles and this means realistic strengths and weaknesses without affecting gameplay too much. For example - don't expect your infantry to take out too many Tiger tanks, but get a few men with anti-tank mines, explosives or bazookas in the area and watch the Tiger get very edgy!

The playing style generally rewards agressive play, but the numbers and skill of your troops, as well as the scenario you are playing. Objectives play a large part in most scenarios and often a game will devolve into a frantic struggle for an objective where your troops may become heroes or corpses fairly fast.

There are strengths and weaknesses, as in all games, which I will try and summarise below:

Strengths:
The unusual way in which shooting works (it depends on how skilled your targets are), the way in which tanks are a nightmare to kill and the way that the game is generally balanced means that most games will be fun. There is a high emphasis on tactics - running your men across an open field in full sight of a HMG platoon yields exactly the same result as you would expect. The ability to pin squads to keep them in place is a brilliant piece of innovation and the none-too-subtle encouragement of a Kommissar is characterful in a way that keeps you in the WWII mindset. Likewise there is no perfect army build - I found airpower not very useful and frankly underpowered, but I have seen top ranking players at tournaments use airpower in their armies.

The models are easy to paint and can look fantastic with very little effort - I spent 5 to 10 minutes on each infantry man and the overall effect looks fantastic. However with effort you can get your figures looking amazing, although a Russian player may develop a nervous tic! Basing can be as complex as you want and with Battlefront supplying bases its easy to do. There are several indie suppliers, but I have not used them although the Battlefront prices are reasonable enough.

The scenarios are well balanced, and while defending can be very hard to get the hang of (and it will feel that the odds are firmly stacked against you) attacking can be equally as hard.

Weaknesses:
The emphasis on tactical play can be hard to learn - and one mistake can concievably cost you the battle. Unfortunately the way you will most likely learn is to get smashed by something. Smoke will almost certainly be forgotten until you are reminded after a particularily bad turn.

Tanks can feel very overpowered, especially the heavy tanks such as KV1's and Tiger's. This is mainly superficial as they can be neutralised fairly easily.

The most broken part of the game is the Wehrmacht tracked bombs/mines - these are heavily overpowered and probably need an overhaul. Fortunately I have only encountered these once, but the game was one of the worst I have played. Similarily barbed wire and minefields are very harsh on infantry - again you might expect this but it can make attacking with an infantry company a real pain.

In terms of the models, I have heard complaints that some of the figures are not overly well proportioned (although they look fine to me) and certainly some of the smaller parts of the tanks (particularily MG's) are very fiddily. I personally have had trouble putting the gun shields on my Marder tank hunter vehicles and only after a certain amount of swearing and bending of the piece did I get it in. The instructions can be vague and some troop types are expensive (monetary costs here) and hard to get.

Costs:
Lets face it, a game is even more fun with low costs! Flames of War is a very reasonably priced Wargame. The rulebook is £27ish and is a good read as well as showing the rules in a concise and easy to read way. There have been very few rules disputes in my experience. The box sets are generally reasonably priced and are often very useful. Similarily Army boxes tend to actually have decent armies within them.

As far as armies go, a Tank Company will cost you the least and a Mechanised Company will cost the most with Infantry Companies falling somewhere inbetween. Generally. A Soviet infantry horde will set you back a pretty penny and probably leave you with the nervous tic I mentioned above. As well as this, the more elite the army, the less it will cost. Soviets are the least skilled and use numbers to compensate and will cost you more, while a Waffen SS army will cost you relatively little as your troops are extremely skilled.

Conclusion
Overall I would reccomend this game to any player with an interest in WWII and/or an interest in having a game where tactics and strategy is important. The figures are exceedingly nice and you can get a great looking army with very little effort. Games, while needing skill, tend to be around the same length as a typical 40K or WFB game and are generally lots of fun.
Highly Reccomended!

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Last edited by Gothkid (2009-02-02 22:19:48)

jimmy

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FoW s 15mm

Jeridian

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Agreed, though as a stickler- Epic is 6mm, FoW is 15mm.

I agree that it's strong point is 'realism', you must learn to make the enemy 'keep their heads down', i.e. Pinned Down by either pouring heavy fire on them (machine guns being ideal) or dropping death from above (artillery and mortars) whilst you advance. Yes, infantry running across open fields against entrenched machine guns is as brutal in FoW as it is in real-life.

Another example of 'realism' are tanks. At a distance they are the gods of war, immune to most of your guns, packing often the most firepower and generally dominating ground and intimidating infantry. If they get close or you have dedicated anti-tank weapons, they're in trouble.
Being highly powerful is balanced the old way by points. A Sherman platoon of 3 tanks being worth more than double an Infantry platoon of 6-8 sections.

Gothkid

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Ooops... <blushes>

And agreed, Si. Tanks are obviously more expensive and I don't think that they are overpowered compared to real life. But the first time you face a platoon of T34's rollling across your lines and the enemy just won't roll 1's it does feel unfair!!

anathema

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At a distance they are the gods of war, immune to most of your guns, packing often the most firepower and generally dominating ground and intimidating infantry. If they get close or you have dedicated anti-tank weapons, they're in trouble.

And therein lies another good thing about the game, 3-4 of the rulebook missions require armoured and mechanised forces to attack their foot-slogging foes to take objectives. If they just sit back and don't take them they automatically lose the game. Hence tanks have to get stuck in and suffer the wrath of emplaced AT guns and infantry weapons if they want to win. This can be quite difficult.

Other points about the game: There are shooting and armour modifiers that represent the effects of short and long range, concealing terrain and units just keeping their heads down and hiding.
Infantry are surprisingly difficult to shift with shooting when dug in, it usually takes a close assault to do it.

There are 'gamey' things you can do with the rules that stretch reality like most systems. Battlefront generally go for rules to represent the overall flavour of armies rather than specifics, it has been described as "the game of the film of WWII" rather than a simulation. It makes concessions to ensure fair fights through a points system rather than historical reality, but otherwise Germans could never win on the Eastern Front after 1944.

I personally find the scale much better than 28mm. A hill is not something to hide a tnak behind, it can be something to hide a whole platoon behind. Terrain seems to make a greater difference and makes the game better for it in much the same way that I'm sure Epic players find.

Overall, I really enjoy playing the game and with the upcoming Hammer and Sickle supplement look forward to driving the Wermacht from Soviet soil in future.

Jeridian

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I personally find the scale much better than 28mm. A hill is not something to hide a tnak behind, it can be something to hide a whole platoon behind. Terrain seems to make a greater difference and makes the game better for it in much the same way that I'm sure Epic players find.

Agreed, though the greatest bonus of smaller model size IMO is that relatively the battlefield is much larger. To clarify, it means you don't start the game with most weapons in range and LOS, and so the only worthwhile tactic being to run forward or shoot.

Nope, in FoW and Epic most weapons are decidedly out of range (common in FoW is 16", in Epic 45cm) on deployment, so movement is very important.
I think this is also an appeal in Warhammer Fantasy for me, the importance of movement. Since movement isn't a random dice roll like shooting, it's down to you 100% and your decision. If you outmaneover your opponent, you know it was through your planning.

In both games, suppression is also represented and very important, often almost as important as killing stuff in the first place.

My FoW Brits are unfortunately at the back of a to-do list that includes an entire VC Fantasy army for BotCh, a 3000pts Epic Nid list, a 3000pts Epic IG list and 1000-1500pts of Epic SM's to make a Scions list, but I have the models and am labouring to finish them.

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Last edited by Jeridian (2009-02-03 11:44:04)

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