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jimbo

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yeah as you were the only person with the chariot army i am sure a beast man player was hot on your heels for it,

the whole thing looks a little bit silly to me, all your games are on random draws so it could end up that you dont play anyone near your skill level, and then theres everything you guys have already gone in to

FalcesImperatoris

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The one problem the new system could create is that power gaming net-list creep will start to spread to all other codex's rather than just the 'top ones'. If you look at the Chaos codex as an example, and how many armies started to be suspiciously similar at the previous GT - there is a risk that this could spread to all Codex's. Especially as you don't need to worry about the meta-game so much, you just need the most powerful build for your own codex to do the best in your group.

Currently, something like Grey Knights you can take along for a bit of fun, and use whatever list you like for the challenge and be an unexpected element - that was always part of the appeal of them for me. The new system has the prospect of pushing new players to take up Daemonhunters just to give them a shot at a prize, who may approach it by spamming whatever seems the most effective build.

The other major problem with the system - is that with about 50% of GW codex's being MEQ, coupled with random games, is that you are going to spend most of the weekend fighting power armour of some varient. While that has always a problem at events to an extent, at least you could have the scope for more ork or eldar armies in attendance for example - which gave a little variety. Now there is just one prize for orks compared with one for each of: Black Templars, Space wolves, Blood Angels, Dark Angels and Standard Marines.

Doesn't seem very sensible to me, unless you like spending your whole weekend playing different flavours of space marine...

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Last edited by FalcesImperatoris (2010-06-29 12:45:58)

skcuzzlebumm

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Interesting point someone made on TWF:

If you take a bugmans meal at an average price of £7.00 each, thats makes each game £6.80 each. Im not being funny but thats a little expensive, especially with 5 random games in which the end result could be 5 of your club locals?

The man has a point, that is a tad expensive for a game.

Jeridian

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The one problem the new system could create is that power gaming net-list creep will start to spread to all other codex's rather than just the 'top ones'.

Not sure I follow or agree on this logic.

This implies that all Codex's can be equally 'WAACed' by someone inclined to do so. This isn't true, some Codex's are more equal than others, far more equal.

The WAACer will have a tough choice, he can take Army X that is tried and proven, very competitive, predictable and taken by most of his WAACer mates.
Or he can take something rarely seen like Grey Knights or Dark Eldar, and have to play much harder to have the same score as with Army X- with the knowledge that having the same score as Army X with his Army Z will win him the tournament or at least improve his score.

The end result being that there will be more obscure/rare/Army Z's taken to a tournament for you to play against, rather than 3-4 games against Army X. I fail to see how this is a bad thing, or how it stops you taking Army Z.

You then go on to talk about how this rules change will see vast swathes of monotonous MEq armies to play against as though this hasn't been the norm for years.

You have to remember that WAAC players aren't psychic, they don't know how many people have the same idea as them, whilst any attempt to collaborate is inherently flawed as (competitively) you want less of Army Z, not more showing up.

I'm being sold on this idea of self-calculating Comp based on army numbers, not as drastic as GW's 'bring rare army, you win', but some mathematical formula where each Codex has a percentage shift based on popularity at the tournament that nudges some pts to rare armies and takes from common armies.

skcuzzlebumm

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Jeridian wrote:
some mathematical formula where each Codex has a percentage shift based on popularity at the tournament that nudges some pts to rare armies and takes from common armies.

Now that is a VERY good idea, and one that I would be behind a lot more than the system they have put forward.

Question, as someone who needs a calculator to add up 2+2, how would you go about working that out?

Russ

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Interesting for all the talk in recent week about how the size of a standard game will be going up for Warhammer their rules pack sticks at 2000pts. Guess my dragon ogre army is totally off now unless anyone knows a tournament of 2500pts or greater that allows special characters

That being said I do like that painting is taken into account, be nice if you still got points for all your banners and nice bases and things. I can just see all the armies being Dwarfs or Tomb kings at the next one though.

Ultima

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Although I think pure scores are a much better system for a tournament, I don't hate the average race system that badly because the intention and effect isnt too bad. It is quite well known that the codexes are obviously not all fairly balanced. Under the old system Chaos, Eldar and Orks were always the most prevalent armies amoungst the top tables. The average system gives the slightly weaker armies recognition. I prefer pure scores as i said but I still understand what GW are trying there.

The problem is random games. That right there stops the tournament being properly competitive. With only 5 games its so possible for people to luck out and play against 3/4 easy opponents or vice versa. GW has loads of hobbyiest events. There was so need whatsoever to take away the one proper competitive gw tournament the more serious players had.

Basically, no free final, less games, same price, shit system....not happening for me!

WarbossKurgan

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Ultima wrote:
Orks were always the most prevalent armies amoungst the top tables.

Wow. It's not a long time since I never thought I'd see that happen!

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Jeridian wrote:

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